My Emblem of Frost pick list and T10 opinion

v3.3

This is my list of stuff to pick up, upgrade-wise from Ice Crown Citadel.

Firstly let me explain that i’m disc/shadow priest.  I spend about 50/50 of my time doing each.  When healing i’m usually raid healing (shield spamming) although occasionally I tank heal (mostly in 10 mans).  We mainly focus on 25 man, although we do plenty of 10 man also.

Anyway here’s my personal list.


Back Volde’s Cloak of the Night Sky I’ll get this first.  Although it’s not best-in-slot it’s not going to be upgraded until we start heroic 25 man raiding.  So I’m planning on wearing this a long time.

Head Crimson Acolyte Cowl which will be swiftly upgraded to Sanctified Crimson Acolyte Cowl.  More on this below.

Shoulders –  Crimson Acolyte Mantle which will be upgraded to Sanctified Crimson Acolyte Mantle. More on this below.

Chest Meteor Chaser’s Raiment.  This is pretty much my best-in-slot unless we do a lot of heroic ICC 25.

Hands Gloves of False Gestures.  These are best-in-slot at time of writing.

Feet Sandals of Consecration.  These are on my pick list, but they are low priority.  Plague Scientist’s Boots from Festergut in ICC 25 are better and we’ll be killing him regularly.

Legs – Not directly purchased with Emblems of Frost but when I get to crafting stuff the Leggings of Woven Death are very nice.

Thats it for the emblem gear.  You will notice that I have 2 pieces of tier 10 shadow gear there.  Based purely on their stats the shadow gear is better for discipline priests.  I will probably work up to 4 piece shadow T10 for the nice bonus to Mind Flay, but how I get there will depend on what the new VoA boss drops (which slots of tier gear he drops) and its too far away to worry about ATM.

I don’t like the 2 piece healing set bonus (Your Flash Heal has a 33% chance to cause the target to heal for 33% of the healed amount over 9 sec).  I don’t use a lot of Flash Heal and this bonus seems weak to me.

For me personally the 4 piece bonus (Your Circle of Healing and Penance spells have a 20% chance to cause your next Flash Heal cast within 6 sec to reset the cooldown on your Circle of Healing and Penance spells) isn’t hugely useful.  I use Penance a fair bit, but 4 pieces of gear with weaker stats doesn’t seem a worthwhile trade-off for me.

If I was doing a lot of tank healing as discipline I would probably go for the 4 piece bonus.  More Penances is good and tank healing I cast a lot more Flash Heal and more Penances.  Both 2 and 4 piece bonuses cater to tank healing discipline priests.

Holy priests are a different story.  If I were spec’ed Holy i’d be looking at the healing T10 gear as the itemisation (with lots of spirit) is much better for them.  The set bonuses still seem pretty weak to me, but they are a bonus.  For Holy the 4 piece set bonus seems weak mainly due to global cool downs.   Your Circle of Healing would be half way off cool down by the time you cast the magic Flash Heal to reset its cool down anyway.  I suppose getting access to CoH a few seconds earlier is better than nothing, but tis not in the same field as having access to Penance about 6 or 7 seconds earlier.

Volde’s Cloak of the Night Sky is still a good choice for holy priests.  Ermine Coronation Robes > Meteor Chaser’s Raiment if you are buying a chest.  Gloves of Ambivalence > Gloves of False Gestures. Circle of Ossus is a very nice waist for holy priests.  They want to craft Lightweave Leggings not Leggings of Woven Death and Sandals of Consecration are still the best crafted feet.

Get all that?

ok done.

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32 Responses to My Emblem of Frost pick list and T10 opinion

  1. Paolo says:

    Pretty much 100% agree. I’m pretty unhappy with t10 for disc, since I’m more bubbly than tanky atm. With so much haste/crit gear in the items above, many of the other pcs (for disc) will need to be focused on crit/spirit. I’m sitting on almost 200 unused emblems while I figure this all out 🙂

  2. Vamptessa says:

    I pretty much agree also, but I am in a 10 man with a resto druid and am mainly tank healing with shield spamming. Rotface already proved I need some more haste/throughput because of all of the dmg people taking, so I might go with the 4pc after all. /sigh 🙂

  3. Vamptessa says:

    So I guess I will go head/shoulders/chest/legs t10 251. Once I upgrade them to 264s (might take some time) then I’ll be 1.5% crit and 30sp behind the offset gear, haste is close. And I’ll be 38 mp5 to the better.

    I guess that is not *terrible* and I get the 2 bonuses. Sound fair for a tank healing disc?

  4. Hernan says:

    I dont really know what to do about Leggings of Woven Death. My guild can kill everything so far (from Marrowgar to Putricide 25m and 10m) so i’m really thinking about getting primordial saronite and craft them.

    What you think about this?.

  5. Xaer says:

    Hey Bob,

    Thx for all the great info!
    If you would get 4-piece disc set, which slot wouldn’t you take? The chest and take the Meteor Chaiser Raiment?

  6. adorno says:

    As a shield spammer and competitive ranking disc priest, Im going the other direction than you and Paolo on this one.

    Im confident the 4 piece healing set is the way to go for disc raid healing.

    – 1st, im betting on the utility of spirit over haste for shield spamming on hardmodes.
    – 2nd, even now it doesn’t hurt to use penance on CD so the 4 piece bonus should give a nice hps boost.

    Incidentally, for 10 mans the 4 piece will be even more useful since you have to do much more positive healing after the raid is saturated with weaken soul.

  7. nuclayer says:

    Has anyone not considered getting any t10 at all.

    I think we can all agree that the 2 piece is pretty lack-luster. The 4 piece looks pretty good and even possibly might be amazing.

    The true problem if find is that the 2 piece t9 is godly. Even as Disc my PoM is usually 10% of my total effective healing and sometimes significantly higher. A 20% loss to that would feel pretty substantial.

    For most raiders, the will not see the Heroic Version of Tier Gear for some time. I plan on getting my Emblem Chest first as it is amazing for the cost.

    The cloak is pretty good too, but finally after farming insanity for a few months I won the Sunreavers cloak 🙂

  8. Piru says:

    I am using the head and shoulders for their 2P, I also went with this way because I am AT haste cap (15%) and my crit is at 35%. I could use more regen& I am not really suffering too much for it.

    Sure, Flash is not my main spell. I am hybridae tank/raid heals, and I usually run with some kind of raid healer (ie, shammy/tree/holy priest) and always a pally. I touch 5k+ hps regularly doing this.

    My issue I have found recently is indeed, I am going short on mana some fights, I gem purely Luminous with a few Royal for the meta. I figure I wont gain any ‘unused’ haste this way, and they’re pretty much direct upgrades from my Halo of Trans& T9 Shoulder.

    I do forsee myself using flash more due to this change. It makes up perhaps 25% of my total healing/aborbs.

  9. BethE says:

    A quick question…do you have a belt choice for Disc or would that be a raid-drop piece?

  10. Arrelliana says:

    I had to answer a couple of questions to pick my upgrade path and had a couple of 264 pieces to work with. My first concern personally was I play holy and disc depending on which spec excels in the fight. We currently raid with 2 priests and I am the only one that specializes with disc (although holy I do just as well). So I needed to balance my gear. I mulled Bob’s info as well as other sites for nearly 2 weeks and kept with my mantra of balance. Since regen was lower on the scale as int and spirit were plentiful on tier gear, I chose to start gemming spellpower/haste/spirit. Since I change specs spirit is valuable as holy and as a regen stat for disc.

    I was fortunate to get the stiffened 264 shoulders so this would be my last slot to upgrade. I chose the leggings of woven death since they were so good for disc and also good for holy just not as much. They dropped the spirit for some regen which is good and the haste is comparable to the pure haste tier pants (which holy would prefer). The leggings do not require badges so I could get them sooner and use them longer.

    My first token went to the headpiece t10 healing one. This one is good for disc and holy and was a straight upgrade over my ony helm. I then chose to go with the chest then gloves and shoulders since chest and gloves would be upgrades with tokens and shoulders last for 4 set bonus.

    I agree with adorno that the regen makes shield spamming viable as the amount of spellpower is very good on all the items and a little more was not make or break. As far as single target healing the set bonuses fair better there so good for disc there. As holy the spirit whore in me loves that although the crit was somewhat less desirable than haste but in wanting balance it is ok. I chose to prioritize offset (boots etc.) with haste so my holy spec would not suffer even if I ended up with some wasted haste in disc spec bubble spam. Haste is never bad for disc on single target spam since faster gcd’s and flashes are good. I rarely find that you can throw a shield every 5 seconds unless you are bubble spamming. The free HOT on the flash doesn’t cost extra mana and buffs the spell that already provides good hps and with DA soap bubbles is even more effective.
    I think sometimes we get locked into worrying about the itemization on tier pieces and that is where we can turn to our other set pieces to balance those out. The ashen band is a great haste/throughput ring and is one example.

    If I was a purely disc priest that didn’t bubble spam exclusively then the shadow pieces etc. are the best choice and the extra throughput probably outweighs the set bonuses.

    Here is my crux on the issue: Comparing the itemization the tier bonuses seem to be free. You get a good mix of stats on any of the pieces set and not-tier even if you prefer haste vs. crit the stats are good. The previous tier had crit and haste in the same spots. So I view the bonuses as just that bonuses. The 2 piece bonus looks to be a 1% boost to effective healing normally in holy/disc and when single target healing 2-3% as disc effective healing. I picking 1 or 2 better itemized pieces would dare have the same or lesser effect overall as 10 extra spellpower or .25% more haste may only affect my overall healing output marginally. 30 spellpower when your sitting at 3k is only 1% not factoring overhealing which always occurs.

    TL:DR I keep it balanced if my tier is crit heavy I go haste in the other slots. And I went with the crafted legs so I get the longest use out of them and they didn’t cost badges… And if you don’t have regen issues then you need to push more buttons and cast more spells because a 1/2 full mana bar is wasted mana.

  11. Donny says:

    Hi Bob,

    This is a kinda off topic post since comment on the relevant topics are closed…

    As a newby alt lvl 80 priest “Rima” I find your “Priestly Resources”-tab very useful but i’d like to ask a few things.
    I think it would be very useful to add https://bobturkey.wordpress.com/2009/05/02/priest-theorycrafting-summary-part-6/ or at least the bottom section regarding the stat weight progression or is this obsolete?

    Is it correct if i would calculate the weight of a certain gem x has y SP and z int to just make following sum: (y*weight SP)+(z*int weight)?
    What im aiming at is, i want to calculate the BiS gemsockets weight to add m to pawn using your stat weights.

    Me main is a warrior tank “Corteth” which is now major back on gear, but i totally agree with your findings.

    Any chace to go theory crafting on that class or got any good links to find proper stat weights for prot and/or arms warriors? (pawn forums didn’t really help and elitist jerks are only talkin bout spreadsheets – but ya first need stat weights before u can make the calculations rite?)

    Let me know if you want me to post this kind of stuff somewhere else or cut with the posts as a whole…

    A big up from belgium, keep at it and again thank you very much.

  12. BobTurkey says:

    @Hernan – Do it?

    @Xaer – If I was going 4 pc T10 i’d probably skip hands and go for Gloves of False Gestures

    @adorno – I agree, both 2 pc and 4 pc T10 bonuses will be more useful generally in 10 man raiding.

    @nuclayer – I upgraded my cloak first as I never seem to get back upgrades.

    @BethE – Belt of Omission is a decent waist slot, for 60 EoF

    @Arrelliana – If I was speced Disc/Holy and only using one set for both i’d gear as a Holy priest. It wouldn’t do a whole lot of harm to your forays as disc, and would make your holy more effective.

    I have done similar in the past, but I quickly started building a 2nd set. i.e. one for holy and one for disc.

    I wouldn’t suggest anyone get to worried about itemisation on tier pieces. By the time you get to T10 your ecperience and skill will be far mroe important than your gear unless you gear really badly (which is hard to do unless your a complete nub).

    “And if you don’t have regen issues then you need to push more buttons and cast more spells because a 1/2 full mana bar is wasted mana.”

    I totally agree. I have a post coming up on that when I stop being so lazy.

    @Donny – I must have deleted the link to the 3.1 stat weights from Priestly REsources. I’ll add it again. The stat weights are relevant when your start gearing up a anew priest. Obviously you have some better options on items to select now with easy EoT access.

    The main reason to retain the 3.1 weights is that regen is very important when you start gearing up.

    Regarding Pawn – if you have an updated version you don’t need to calculate the stat weights for gems, it does it for you now. But yes your calculations are correct.

    Theorycrafting priests is enough (too much?) for me. For prot warriors check out sites like TankSpot.com. Arms is a different story. There are no resources out there for them as far as i’m aware. I almost started theorycrafting for arms warriors, but I jsut don’t have time. Plus its the off-spec of an alt so… low priority sorry.

    If anyone knows of a good, up-to-date Arms warrior resource and even better stat weights, let me know. I’d love to use it.

    Your welcome Donny.

    Gobble gobble.

  13. Taynt says:

    Great list thanks =)

    i too spend 50/50 raiding as shadow/disc. So touching on the shadow side (I am assuming most of this gear will serve both your specs) what pieces are you going to bring in for hit?

  14. BobTurkey says:

    No idea actually Taynt.

    I have heaps of pieces with hit lying around so i’ll just fiddle them around until I have enough hit and am happy.

  15. Turrin says:

    How can you say Sandals are better than Deathfrost when you have a Shadow OS? 80 spirit = 64 hit + 16 crit, seems an easy choice.

  16. Turrin says:

    @nuclayer – little to no tier is my goal. Better off letting tier go to others that will benefit from it. Do grab the tier heal shoulders, there is not much for that slot. The ceremonial crown off gunboat is good, meteor chasers, and for your left nut, the crafted legs. 60 token gloves and cloak are no brainers too.

    Spirit will be unavoidable in some pieces as Disc, but that isn’t so terrible. Remember, after you build your 264 set, you can always focus your heroic upgrades to replace what you don’t need, or augment what you do need.

  17. Blacksmurf says:

    Pre-T9 – as Holy, I was favoring int/crit. but since then, i have tried to get more haste and more spirit.

    However, it seems that those 2 stats are rarely on the same item. Using your own 3.3 lootrank(holy) the crafted items with spirit rank much higher than, the one with haste. Lightweave Leggings vs. Leggings of Woven Death.

    What factors do you apply when choosing haste, over spirit – do you have sertain point where you feel haste is more valuable, than the weight of the theorycrafting.

  18. Tomer says:

    Great list; thanks for all the advice.

    Since you’ll be using the same helm for disc and shadow, which meta will you use? I’m currently using the 11mp5 / 3% crit heal for disc and the 21crit / 3% crit dmg for shadow.

  19. Arrelliana says:

    Hey bob, got the 4piece t10 to test out tonight…can I say HORRIBLE!!! And I really mean it. For discipline here is the problem…

    Cast Penance (1.5~channel or so) the buff procs on cast so after penance you have 4.5 seconds to hit flash heal (1 second)so @ 3 seconds (with a perfect reaction time not factoring lag on 2 spells) you shave 1-2 seconds off penance. I could easily just queue up another flash or shield for borrowed time and end up with a faster penance or another flash.

    For holy..just too clunky unless you were a tank healing holy priest spamming flash on the tank and throwing circle on cooldown. The only time it is really nice is when you circle (surge procs) surge Circle again..otherwise same issue..little lag and then cast time on flash just make it easier to fill the gap with a pom on CD or a renew or another flash or anything.

    My verdict is you end up looking for the proc named(Flash Heal!) and not focusing on proactive raid healing. The micro managing of a proc is the same reason that people say a talent that adds 3% more healing is better than say test of faith which is more healing on a target below 50% health.

    In an agressive 25 man raid environment (especially renew specced) the holy bonus pigeon holes you into not healing the best for the spec. As disc flash heal is just too powerful and you have too many other tools in your arsenal to fill those gaps more effectively.

    So now I will make sure to pimp out both specs with the best in slot options for disc and holy and only run with probably 2 pieces of tier 10. I don’t mind the 2 piece set bonus for disc as it does buff flash heal and on tank heavy damage encounters it is a good buff. I have hit up to 6% effective healing before in ICC 25’s with it..on average though 2% which is what can I say better than trauma’s proc.

    Althor’s Abacus is by far the most throughput hitting 3% effective healing regularly but I am fortunate to have double solace now so I have a hard time spamming myself out of mana. I have even went to gemming spellpower/haste oranges to remove some of the regen as it just isn’t getting used.

    Just wanted to pass along what I have found..glad we can rent out the items and test them.

  20. BobTurkey says:

    @Turrin – Deathfrost Boots are good too, but I have hit rating coming out my wazoo! My Disc set has 180 odd ATM.

    @Blacksmurf – I haven’t played Holy for a little while, but I suspect I’d mostly prefer spirit to haste if I did. More spell power and more regen. I seem to accumualte about 15-20% haste anyway without trying to.

    @Tomer – Very good question and one that I hadn’t considered. Probably “21crit / 3% crit dmg for shadow” initially unless I had mana issues when healing.

    @Arrelliana – Interesting observations. Holy is what I expected. I’m surprised you didn’t find it more useful for Disc.

    Althor’s Abacus is very nice. I must get one. Been passing on them to the full time healers so far.

    Gobble gobble.

  21. landslide says:

    Hey Bob — have you seen this?

    http://code.google.com/p/simulationcraft/

    was linked from wow.com today….

  22. BobTurkey says:

    Simcraft? Yep. Another useful tool if you take the time to figure out how to use it and do so.

  23. Arrelliana says:

    Just an opinion question for anyone: Which is more forgiving, gearing up disc then switching to holy spec, or gearing holy and switching to disc. Which gear set is better for the opposite spec.

  24. Cym says:

    Right now I have the Meteor Chaser’s Raiment and T10 gloves, thinking I should have waited for the Gloves of False Gestures though – it was my first frost piece though so i was going for a cheaper item :P. Looking at getting the made pants and shoes and Volde’s Cloak of the Night Sky as my next badge piece. Only doing 10P stuff though mainly on tank heals with the odd 25. Didn’t get far in the 25 ICC the other day though as we couldn’t clear the 1st boss. Recently switched to the mana/crit heal meta to try out too.

  25. Aerv says:

    @arrelliana. I Think you are Better of with the Holy Set as a Disc As with the Disc Set As Holy … Why ? Because Holy Needs much more Mana and is much more Depending on Spirit. As Disc you might end up with Top much mana and loosing Somerset Output, but that’s Better As a Holy Priest going oom ^^

  26. BobTurkey says:

    @Aerv – I think the reverse. Better to be disc with too much mana than holy with not enough. So gear for holy then switching to disc is easier. imho.

    Gobble gobble

  27. Nioma says:

    Why not Drape of the Violet Tower? It’s better based on your scales. I feel like I’m missing something 60 spirit > 30 mp5? Was this item changed?

  28. BobTurkey says:

    For disc you are correct, the MP5 is slightly better than the spirit. However, as I mention near the top, I spend half my time a shadow. Mp5 is pretty pointless for shadow where as a the spirit adds a small amount of DPS.

    Volde’s Cloak of the Night Sky id also better if I go back to holy for some reason.

  29. Piru says:

    Bob: I heard that after something like 1500 or 1600 int that spirit begins to outweigh mp5 on regen.
    Can you discuss this sometime?

  30. adorno says:

    Little update from me on this topic, I’m happy to report that I can support my choice to go with the t10.

    I was a couple weeks late getting started emblems. I started on the two piece, but the general reception of our t10 gave me cold feet to go all the way. I finally did last night, and I’m happy I did.

    Results may vary, I suppose, as Arrelliana’s post indicates. But my impressions so far are quite positive, given the alternatives.

    Edit: Check out Adorno’s post on his/her blog regarding this.

  31. Powerwordftw says:

    I’d have to completely agree with Arrelliana regarding 4set T10 – too much micromanagement watching for procs (even when using addons like Power Auras) which is detrimental to your healing style.

    I am Spec’d Disc/Holy – Disc in 10s, Disc/Holy 50/50 in 25s depending on fights and group builds.

    I was using 2pc T9.5 (245 gloves/pants) for the amazing bonus to PoM and 2pc T10 (251 helm/shoulders) and found this to be far more beneficial to my healing output than 4pc T10. I had been using this for the past few weeks but this past week decided to go 4pc T10 and test it out in a clear of ICC. My healing performance was worse than the previous weeks and I’d strongly advise going for non tier pieces with great stats instead of any of the tier gear.

    Blessed healing only makes up 1-2% of my healing. Usually less than 1% if I’m playing Holy.

    An example of how bad the RNG can be for the Flash Heal! proc – in a 25 dreamwalker clear last night there was me (Disc) and a resto druid staying out full time looking after the raid and it only proc’d once the entire fight. of course this was very bad RNG. I’ve had it proc several times in a row for me which is also fun – Pen, FH, Pen, FH, Pen – good fun!

    It was slightly handy and proc’d a lot more in our sindragosa kill and lich king attempts which is nice to have but I still feel it’s lacking and a restriction on my play style.

  32. Priestvvanted says:

    i just turn disc i i kind need some help on my stats…when do i have to stop stacking intel? and what are good stats for Critica%, Hast%, and mana pool size…

    thank you very much

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